Alright already, here’s the source

Here is the source and binaries of the Schematic Tables demo. I really don’t think it is of use to anyone, but I am getting tired of explaining that. This stuff is on the shelf right now while I work on other language issues.

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10 Comments

  1. Posted November 7, 2008 at 9:14 am | Permalink

    Embrace community!

  2. skztr
    Posted November 7, 2008 at 12:12 pm | Permalink

    I feel almost as if I’ve contributed to the betterment of society. By complaining like an annoying child, I have changed THE WORLD (*starry eyes*).

    Thanks for the code. Like I said, it doesn’t really matter if it’s useful, releasing code has the potential to get people talking.

  3. Posted November 12, 2008 at 5:18 pm | Permalink

    Thank you! 😀

  4. Posted November 19, 2008 at 12:24 pm | Permalink

    Wow. You don’t realize how helpful this is for all the believers out there.

  5. Jason Livesay
    Posted November 25, 2008 at 9:40 pm | Permalink

    God bless you or whatever atheists (or humanists or whatever I am, hopefully I can identify that I do believe in _something_ and what it is eventually) are supposed to say that is more emphatic than thank you.

    Now hopefully there is at least one person in the world that can actually contribute to your software (even though its far from finished). Do you think that might be the case and have you identified any such persons?

    I have been trying over the last few months (probably years actually) to tell programmers that the fact that we have to write software using one dimensional text is pretty stupid.. and almost all of them have agreed that I am a complete idiot for thinking that.

    Also last night I was (initially) enjoying a religious battle because I decided to post on reddit a statement about how outdated emacs and lisp were and was advising someone seeking advice on programming editors not to select emacs or vim and to choose a newer modern IDE. Now my comment karma is -75. Yay!

    Anyway, I have been programming since I was 8 years old (31 now) and have felt for quite some time that there must be some more sophisticated ways than to rely on editing text, but have had great difficulty finding people that agreed and had reasonable solutions. Subtext is really validating for my whole existence in more ways than I can describe in a comment.

    Are you going to start a project on Sourceforge or something along those lines?


    Jason, thanks for your support. Yes, I will definitely start an open source project at some point. But now is not that point. As I have discussed previously, I have concluded that atextual programming just isn’t going to sell on its own merits. It needs to be a Trojan Horse, like garbage collection was in Java. I am working now on what I hope is a more compelling focus. Subtext will still be there in some form underneath, but it won’t be the headline. – Jonathan

  6. Jason Livesay
    Posted November 26, 2008 at 8:30 pm | Permalink

    After looking at the other textual semantic demo I just wanted to share a couple of my ideas that might be slightly relevant. My big software development revolution fantasy that I have had in my head for some time now incorporates as many of your concepts as I have been able to fit in fantasy (will have to come back later for details if there is ever an implementation).

    But anyway my thought process has gone from thinking I am going to be able to implement and or sell my software on my own to feeling that I should focus on features that enable real-time programming collaboration and information sharing. So the idea is that although things like C# in Visual Studio might be the most productive tools for me on my own, if I could build something in Flash/ActionScript 3 it would be instantly available online to anyone that visited my web site. So I have a picture of something like Visio or an interactive whiteboard that has sort of an infinitely (or very large) sized page and also has the capability for many simultaneous users editing diagrammatic, textual, graph elements in real time. That way all of the software development innovations that I think are key I could place on this page and say “OK everyone, this is what we need to implement”.

    Now add some interactive programming ability like a schematic table, some code generation, code evaluation or anything that allows groups to program together in two dimensions in a shared space.

    My feeling is that you have a lot of good programmers visiting your site and if you had system like the one I have described then you could instantly recruit quite a few of them to continue to develop your demo application in real time into something that less enlightened outsiders would have to pay attention to (partly because of the engaged social network already using it for example to build the next web application code generator).

    Jason, good point about collaboration, I’ll try to keep that in mind. Flash is appealing, but I am currently planning to use Silverlight. It is easy to bootstrap, is already at 25% penetration, and is a full generation ahead in language technology. Actionscript and its VM are toys in comparison. Silverlight gives you C#, F#, Ruby, Python, and much of the .NET ecosystem. Keep the faith – Jonathan

  7. Jason Livesay
    Posted November 27, 2008 at 2:27 am | Permalink

    That’s cool to find out that you were thinking about Silverlight already..

    ok.. Silverlight is great.. and I have some experience with it some months back on a job .. was making the microsoft fluent interface thing and my boss wanted regular wpf styles and other things in silverlight so i was trying to make it work like the full fledged wpf.. .net is awesome and so is f# and as far as the level of sophistication of the technology of course its better than actionscript 3 but I have experience with both and as3 has a lot of useful features and is not nearly as slow as as2 was.. and for a c# guy like myself it was really easy to pick up.. I guess I would be more excited about silverlight if it i could figure out how to make it run on my computer (install keeps messing up somehow). one more knock on silverlight is that it doesnt run on linux and I am not sure what level of adoption or compatibility the mono guys are going to have with their version.

    anyway the browser penetration is the biggest thing for me right now.. if it were 70% then maybe I could just say forget the linux people if moonlight wasnt compatible but to me the whole point of going to the web is making sure _everyone_ can access it easily. if those problems go away then i will get excited about silverlight again

  8. John "Z-Bo" Zabroski
    Posted December 3, 2008 at 2:36 pm | Permalink

    The “level of sophistication” of .NET truly is amazing. I’m surprised more open source developers aren’t attracted to improving Mono and therefore piggybacking off Microsoft Research’s amazing innovations.

    The only open source envy I experience at work is not having Haskell or Clojure available from within .NET as a native VM language.

    Thanks for the source, Jonathan. Although. I wish you would’ve announced it on the mailing list! I’m “behind the times” and don’t use RSS.

    I’d be interested in what your dev experiences with Silverlight are. Keep a developer diary, then share with us how you went through learning Silverlight coming from WPF. Microsoft architect JOhn Gossman has said the plan is for Silverlight apps to be ported to WPF, not the other way around. — essentially, Silverlight is supposed to strip out the colossal mistakes of WPF – in particular navigation and routed commands.

    [Interesting. I was thinking of doing it the other way around, hoping that Silverlight would catch up to WPF in some respects, most noticeably (to me) its horrid text rendering. – Jonathan]

  9. Blake Courtney
    Posted December 10, 2008 at 11:46 pm | Permalink

    Hey thanks for the code, guess it’s time to rid ourselves of that old pesky distributed computing problem.

  10. Jon
    Posted February 5, 2009 at 5:13 pm | Permalink

    I can’t get it to run. I just get an error saying it has encountered a problem and needs to close. Anyone know what might be the problem and how to fix it?

2 Trackbacks

  • By Geekstorming» Blog Archive on November 7, 2008 at 6:00 pm

    […] Jonathan Edwards released the source and binaries for his Schematic Tables demo.  (Paper, […]

  • By I Write » Subtext on December 27, 2008 at 4:51 pm

    […] someone posted this link on programming reddit where someone had posted a link to the the page where Jonathan Edwards (Subtext creator) has posted a link to the prototype used in […]

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